Seven Minutes

**Piña** · June 28th, 2004, 04:16 PM

We were under attack.

The president was in a known location.

300 children and civilians were present.

Seven minutes is plenty of time to die and take them with you.

His number one concern at the time was supposed to be to remain safe and get to a secure location. This is bottom line in any crisis situation. You protect the commander in chief so that he can lead.

His secondary concern should have been the children who he was putting in danger. He had no way of knowing what form these attacks were or could take and should have removed himself immediately.

If the terrorists has targetted him personally and he had stayed and those children died because he sat on his ass would you want to fact thier parents and tell them "Well, he's just this guy like the rest of us. It's OK."

It was a dereliction of duty and a major dropping of the ball.

**Piña** · June 28th, 2004, 04:24 PM

Cincygreg

I've been in emergeny situations and I know how I react. I go into get the job done mode. Instantly. It's just how I work.

It doesn't matter if this was a new situation. There are supposed to be contingency plans in place for emergencies. There is supposed to be planning for all concievable what-if situations and the president is supposed to know at least the basics of how to react in an emergency.

I expect my president to be on top of things and to act without hesitation in the face of crisis. He is supposed to be better than the, how many people are in this country, 300 million others who live in the US.

The reason we elect the best, in theory, is so that we have someone who can do the job without freezing up. Someone who knows how to lead in all situations. Someone who we expect to not fold under stress.

I'm sorry if you thing that's asking too much but I think it's part and parcel of taking on the job of the most powerful person on the planet.

**travelinman** · June 28th, 2004, 04:32 PM

So losing your nuclear codes and making every single American a sitting duck is ok? Oh, let's not forget not taking the time from your golf game to take care of this.

**jumper69** · June 28th, 2004, 04:41 PM

So losing your nuclear codes and making every single American a sitting duck is ok?

Huh??? [img]confused.gif[/img]

**Piña** · June 28th, 2004, 04:47 PM

Trav is just being annoying and is attempting to distract attention away from bushozo by attacking Clinton.

The NeoCon Standing order #1: When you can't defend the bushette attack someone else.

[ June 28, 2004 01:47 PM: Message edited by: Pi?a ]

**travelinman** · June 28th, 2004, 04:54 PM

Originally posted by Jumper69:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />So losing your nuclear codes and making every single American a sitting duck is ok?

Huh??? [img]confused.gif[/img] <hr /></blockquote>Read my post above

**gae** · June 28th, 2004, 04:58 PM

Originally posted by Jumper69:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />So losing your nuclear codes and making every single American a sitting duck is ok?

Huh??? [img]confused.gif[/img] <hr /></blockquote>Jumper, see Trav's post above and check out this link. http://www.bookfinder.us/review9/0895261405.html

Pina,
Just curious. How long did it take FDR to react to Pearl Harbor? I know I could look it up, but you do such good research.

The statement "The country is under attack" is interesting and more than a bit ambigious. Source, please? (And if it's Michael Moore, your entire argument is moot.) And, what was Clinton told when the WTC was attacked the first time? Or when the Cole was attacked? Or the embassies overseas?

Also,

Seven minutes of sitting on his deserter ass crying inside for mommy.

Deserter? Credible source, please.

Crying inside for mommy? Credible source, please.

20/20 hindsight is a wonderful thing, don'tcha think? Since you're so good at it, you ought to go back a few years and wonder why Clinton didn't take OBL from the Sudan when offered.

**travelinman** · June 28th, 2004, 04:58 PM

Originally posted by Pi?a:
Trav is just being annoying and is attempting to distract attention away from bushozo by attacking Clinton.

The NeoCon Standing order #1: When you can't defend the bushette attack someone else.

[ June 28, 2004 01:47 PM: Message edited by: Pi?a ]

Just like the best damn talk show host on the air.

**travelinman** · June 28th, 2004, 05:05 PM

PEARL HARBOR
MOTHER OF ALL CONSPIRACIES

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"...everything that the Japanese were planning to do was known to the United States..." ARMY BOARD, 1944
President Roosevelt (FDR) provoked the attack, knew about it in advance and covered up his failure to warn the Hawaiian commanders. FDR needed the attack to sucker Hitler to declare war, since the public and Congress were overwhelmingly against entering the war in Europe. It was his backdoor to war.

FDR blinded the commanders at Pearl Harbor and set them up by -

denying intelligence to Hawaii (HI)
on Nov 27, misleading the commanders into thinking negotiations with Japan were continuing to prevent them from realizing the war was on
having false information sent to HI about the location of the Japanese carrier fleet.
BACKGROUND
1904 - The Japanese destroyed the Russian navy in a surprise attack in undeclared war.
1932 - In The Grand Joint Army Navy Exercises the attacker, Admiral Yarnell, attacked with 152 planes a half-hour before dawn 40 miles NE of Kahuku Point and caught the defenders of Pearl Harbor completely by surprise. It was a Sunday.
1938 - Admiral Ernst King led a carrier-born airstrike from the USS Saratoga successfully against Pearl Harbor in another exercise.
1940 - FDR ordered the fleet transferred from the West Coast to its exposed position in Hawaii and ordered the fleet remain stationed at Pearl Harbor over complaints by its commander Admiral Richardson that there was inadequate protection from air attack and no protection from torpedo attack. Richardson felt so strongly that he twice disobeyed orders to berth his fleet there and he raised the issue personally with FDR in October and he was soon after replaced. His successor, Admiral Kimmel, also brought up the same issues with FDR in June 1941.
7 Oct 1940 - Navy IQ analyst McCollum wrote an 8 point memo on how to force Japan into war with US. Beginning the next day FDR began to put them into effect and all 8 were eventually accomplished.
11 November 1940 - 21 aged British planes destroyed the Italian fleet, including 3 battleships, at their homeport in the harbor of Taranto in Southern Italy by using technically innovative shallow-draft torpedoes.
11 February 1941 - FDR proposed sacrificing 6 cruisers and 2 carriers at Manila to get into war. Navy Chief Stark objected: "I have previously opposed this and you have concurred as to its unwisdom. Particularly do I recall your remark in a previous conference when Mr. Hull suggested (more forces to Manila) and the question arose as to getting them out and your 100% reply, from my standpoint, was that you might not mind losing one or two cruisers, but that you did not want to take a chance on losing 5 or 6." (Charles Beard PRESIDENT ROOSEVELT AND THE COMING OF WAR 1941, p 424)
March 1941 - FDR sold munitions and convoyed them to belligerents in Europe -- both acts of war and both violations of international law -- the Lend-Lease Act.
23 Jun 1941 - Advisor Harold Ickes wrote FDR a memo the day after Germany invaded the Soviet Union, "There might develop from the embargoing of oil to Japan such a situation as would make it not only possible but easy to get into this war in an effective way. And if we should thus indirectly be brought in, we would avoid the criticism that we had gone in as an ally of communistic Russia." FDR was pleased with Admiral Richmond Turner's report read July 22: "It is generally believed that shutting off the American supply of petroleum will lead promptly to the invasion of Netherland East Indies...it seems certain she would also include military action against the Philippine Islands, which would immediately involve us in a Pacific war." On July 24 FDR told the Volunteer Participation Committee, "If we had cut off the oil off, they probably would have gone down to the Dutch East Indies a year ago, and you would have had war." The next day FDR froze all Japanese assets in US cutting off their main supply of oil and forcing them into war with the US. Intelligence information was withheld from Hawaii from this point forward.
14 August - At the Atlantic Conference, Churchill noted the "astonishing depth of Roosevelt's intense desire for war." Churchill cabled his cabinet "(FDR) obviously was very determined that they should come in."
18 October - diary entry by Secretary of Interior Harold Ickes: "For a long time I have believed that our best entrance into the war would be by way of Japan."

http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/6315/pearl.html

**Piña** · June 28th, 2004, 05:44 PM

See what I mean. Trav and Gae can't defend the idiot in office so they try to distract and attack others.

Frankly, I don't give a damn abbout speculation about what other's have done in the past. I care that we have actually seen our "leader" fold in the face of crisis.

Go play distraction games in some other thread if you can't deal with his shutting down under stress.

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